Push button start and shutdown

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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby coizamora » Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:12 pm

coizamora wrote:Hi Jean
News about firmware release?
Tks

???????????????????????
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Tue Nov 04, 2014 3:14 pm

I'm sorry for not getting back before but there is currently no news. There are many things I need to deal with at this time and the code update has been delayed.

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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby coizamora » Sun Jan 18, 2015 1:34 am

I dont have rpm and adc on-off output dont work in tiny iox, please help me
I need a star button working only please
Attachments
CAN1_CurrentTune.msq
(31.11 KiB) Downloaded 102 times
clio.msq
(223.56 KiB) Downloaded 104 times
clio_2015-01-18_02.27.37.tsproj
(784.18 KiB) Downloaded 97 times
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Sun Jan 18, 2015 1:39 am

I'm sorry but I don't understand the first part of the question about the rpm and adc on-off output. Can you say it some other way?

As for the start button, the start function is there but the stop function is not yet there. But I have made a bit of progress on it.

Jean
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby coizamora » Sun Jan 18, 2015 1:44 am

ts.png
ts.png (333.22 KiB) Viewed 6290 times

ms3 and the tiny not communicate, rpm, ego and
the starting button also stopped working
Please help me with configuration
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Sun Jan 18, 2015 7:25 pm

Your project has the CAN ID for the MS3 set to 5. If your MS3 really has its CAN ID set to 5 then it will not work. The TinyIOx assumes that the MS3 has a CAN ID of 0.

Why did you change the MS3 CAN ID?

Jean
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Sun Jan 18, 2015 7:42 pm

Another thing that was not correct was that you had enabled outmsg (in the base I/O settings): you can't do that without also doing the equivalent on the MS3. And this is not something that is quite ready at this time.

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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby coizamora » Sun Jan 18, 2015 8:35 pm

Jean please help me with project/can configuration, I'm completely lost.
Tks in advance
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:48 pm

In your project you had a conflict between the port settings and the push button start: they were both using PTE2 and PTE3. This is what you had:

wrong_port_settings.png
Wring port settings
wrong_port_settings.png (26.64 KiB) Viewed 6272 times


You need to remove the input and output you use for the push button start from the port settings. You need to have this:

correct_port_settings.png
Correct port settings
correct_port_settings.png (26.92 KiB) Viewed 6272 times


You also need to disable outmsg:

disable_outmsg.png
Disable outmsg
disable_outmsg.png (26.38 KiB) Viewed 6272 times


On the MS3, you need to set the MS3 CAN ID to 0:

can_param.png
CAN parameters: my CAN ID
can_param.png (46.83 KiB) Viewed 6272 times


You also need to set the correct CAN ID in the project properties:

main_canid.png
Main controller CAN ID
main_canid.png (24.11 KiB) Viewed 6272 times


You will need to update your project offline to change the MS3 CAN ID (both places) and you will need to reload the firmware on your MS3 before opening the corrected project (make sure to not save your configuration when the ms3loader asks you if you want to save it).

You could do this without reloading the firmware but you need to do things in the correct order and carefully otherwise you will not be able to correct the CAN ID and the project. So just do as I say above and you will be fine. Make sure to reload your correct configuration when you connect your MS3 to your project.

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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby coizamora » Wed Jan 21, 2015 10:32 pm

Hi Jean
I still have no rpm at the tiny iox.
here is my project and log:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwAqff0Pz7BLVE5oWjkwLUhkcUU/view?usp=sharing
tks in advance
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Thu Jan 22, 2015 11:24 pm

You were using MS3 release 1.3.3 in your previous project. This latest project uses pre 1.4 alpha 9; that's the problem. That version has a CAN bus bug. Use the latest one (pre 1.4 beta 10: http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewtopic ... 25&t=57276) which corrects those bugs. I have checked with your project and it does work with that version.

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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby coizamora » Sun Jan 25, 2015 8:35 am

jbelanger wrote:You were using MS3 release 1.3.3 in your previous project. This latest project uses pre 1.4 alpha 9; that's the problem. That version has a CAN bus bug. Use the latest one (pre 1.4 beta 10: http://www.msextra.com/forums/viewtopic ... 25&t=57276) which corrects those bugs. I have checked with your project and it does work with that version.

Jean

Really appreciate your help
I installed 1.4 a10
All works again!
Thanks Jean
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby dontz125 » Tue Nov 17, 2015 6:40 pm

jbelanger wrote:As for the start button, the start function is there but the stop function is not yet there. But I have made a bit of progress on it.

I had completely forgotten about this one. I'm looking at this again, trying to shut down an MS2 without using a brute force technique with interposing mosfets etc.

Any thoughts?
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Tue Nov 17, 2015 6:58 pm

Yes, I've been thinking about it since I saw your posts on the msextra forum. One of the functions I want to implement is exactly the one you mention for the tip over protection which has an adjustable delay before shutting down the engine.

So from a digital input (either on the IOx/TIOx or from a CAN input), the code would send a CAN command to shut down the engine (spark, fuel or both) after the input has been active (on or off, as per the user config) for the duration of the delay. If the delay is not reached, the timer is reset until the next event.

I also want to have a push button shut down that uses the same button as for starting (after a user defined push delay or a series of "panic" pushes) and a hard immediate stop from a different button. But this tip over delayed shut down can also be completely independent and would use a separate input.

I know I've been promising this for quite a while but I should have something on the TIOx relatively soon. It will then be ported to the IOx. I'll post a preliminary user interface screen of what I have in mind in the coming days.

By the way, do you have any thoughts on how to get out of the shutdown state? I was thinking it could be back on as soon as the input is reset or there could be a delay or it could require a power cycle. Depending on the situation, each one could be problematic or desirable.

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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby dontz125 » Tue Nov 17, 2015 7:12 pm

Hi, Jean.

The kill / NCS function should be immediate, no delay, so sharing it with the tip-over input could be interesting. Reset from any of the 'oh crap' conditions should also be immediate - whether a tail flick that started the tip-over timer, or your boot slipped while stretching during a long ride and you kicked your sidestand down and immediately chopped the engine, as soon as the tip over switch settles down or you get the stand back up, normal function has to resume immediately.

Anything else leaves you as either a chicane or - worst case - a speed bump in traffic.

I had a fellow ask me about the tip-over timer and whether - as you suggested - there should be an extended reset. Under normal circumstances, an unscheduled redistribution of gravity will see the engine cut in 1.5s, and then coming to a stop in a very few seconds after that, even from WFO, even while skittering along in the gravel trap. At that point, you pick up the bike, get back on, restart and (if the marshals don't grab you first) get back in the race. If you manage to get it back upright and clear the tip-over switch before the engine actually stops turning, that's called "saving it", and well done you! :lol: (I saw a video a while back of a racer who had it all the way over to his shoulder, and pushed it back up onto two wheels with his ELBOW. Now, THAT's a save!)
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Tue Nov 17, 2015 7:26 pm

I may not understand what you meant but I don't see how we could share an input for the immediate shutdown function and the delayed one. So that would require 2 separate inputs for these 2 functions.

And I agree that the immediate return from a shutdown state makes the most sense. I can actually think of exceptional events where that would not be desirable (a bike slides and gets back up when it hits a fence) but that's exceptional compared to other situations.

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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby dontz125 » Tue Nov 17, 2015 7:42 pm

I was being facetious - sorry. Yes, 2 inputs.

And yes, weird events like run-away bikes are too rare to build in safe guards - even if they are funny to watch, when it isn't your bike!
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:24 pm

dontz125 wrote:I was being facetious - sorry. Yes, 2 inputs.

I wasn't sure if that's what it was or if I was missing something.

dontz125 wrote:And yes, weird events like run-away bikes are too rare to build in safe guards - even if they are funny to watch, when it isn't your bike!

... and it doesn't hit you.

This is what I think the new push button start/stop and engine shutdown settings should look like:

Image

I've kept generic description of the 2 shutdown functions since they may not be useful only for bikes. The input port for each one includes all the physical ports of the TIOx as well as the CAN port channels for the 3 digital I/O ports and the new virtual ports (these will be explained in the post for the latest TIOx firmware release).

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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby dontz125 » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:32 pm

Those look perfect. Will the shut down NOW port have an internal pull-up, so when the grounding "keep running" signal vanishes it triggers, or should an external PU be added? With the timed delay,it would still want a pull-up, so the deliberate 'oops' signal pulls it down.

Speaking of the latest TIOx firmware - could you include default .msqs? It gets confusing trying to find a suitable tune file, so I don't have a tune full of junk when I open it ... :?
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Re: Push button start and shutdown

Postby jbelanger » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:49 pm

dontz125 wrote:Those look perfect. Will the shut down NOW port have an internal pull-up, so when the grounding "keep running" signal vanishes it triggers, or should an external PU be added? With the timed delay,it would still want a pull-up, so the deliberate 'oops' signal pulls it down.

When a pin is configured as a digital input, I set the internal pull up. However, this is a weak pull up so an external pull up will always be a stiffer one.

dontz125 wrote:Speaking of the latest TIOx firmware - could you include default .msqs? It gets confusing trying to find a suitable tune file, so I don't have a tune full of junk when I open it ... :?

I thought I had but it's only for the IOx releases that I've done that. I will provide one for the upcoming TIOx release and I'll add one for the recent one.

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